F1 2021

[weeloaney]

Come on guys the most impressive part of the race was the acceleration stretch on totos headphones as he slammed them down. That slowmo was just awesome

That was some real anger

Honestly think Massi caused that contact, RB knew about the place swap and Merc were just being told, Ant Davidson also had a great point about gamesmanship neither wanting to be in front at the drs line

What I don’t understand is why Massi didn’t inform both teams at the same time, he made a mess and both drivers got caught up in not wanting to give the other drs, but Ver did slow down twice, and moved left, so he gets penalised

Yes the rules around this will need looked at. Masi should have informed Mercedes first then RBR.

This was my thoughts straight away. Merc and Hamilton in this case SHOULD be informed before redbull and max were.

 

[Blackie]

But I am 100% right lol

Seems the Stewards with all the information disagree with you lol.

69bar pressure on the brake pedal resulting in a 2.4g deceleration! That screams brake check!

Most other drivers simply lift off the throttle, they don’t brake, oh and as I said before they also move clearly to one side of the track.

 

[Jbridges522]

Your all misreading me.

I 100% agree Max caused the accident by a sharp jab of the brakes and should be penalised.

But IMO LH has to be penalised for his part also, saying he played no part in causing a dangerous situation is crazy. A car is slowing to one side of the track so you follow right behind him??? They both knew what they were doing IMO.

And no other information is very likely to change that view, did he provide an explanation for why he didn't pass him? I haven't seen one.

 

[Blackie]

Max also showed his colours when he all but stormed off the podium!

He is still showing a lack of maturity after the years he has now been in the sport. He just doesn’t have many redeeming features of a race driver other than serious talent when he is behaving himself.

 

[weeloaney]

Seems the Stewards with all the information disagree with you lol.

69bar pressure on the brake pedal resulting in a 2.4g deceleration! That screams brake check!

Most other drivers simply lift off the throttle, they don’t brake, oh and as I said before they also move clearly to one side of the track.

And they move completely to one side.

Anyway, Stewards have all the data and cameras we don’t to make the decision, but random people seem to know better.

Shït show for decisions and for plenty of reason that was a genuine what the **** race

 

[CloudStrife]

Behave @Jbridges522

 

[Jbridges522]

but random people seem to know better.

We are just having a civil discussion, kind of the point of the thread.

 

[sam_9n]

Your all misreading me.

I 100% agree Max caused the accident by a sharp jab of the brakes and should be penalised.

But IMO LH has to be penalised for his part also, saying he played no part in causing a dangerous situation is crazy. A car is slowing to one side of the track so you follow right behind him??? They both knew what they were doing IMO.

And no other information is very likely to change that view, did he provide an explanation for why he didn't pass him? I haven't seen one.

Just copied this from his press conference interview.

“There were two scenarios, one it wasn’t clear and two I didn’t get the information,”

“Then it became apparent that he was trying to let me past, which I guess he had been asked to do, but before the DRS zone.

“That meant he would’ve DRS’d back past, follow me through the last corner and then DRS me into Turn 1. So that was a tactic.

“But the worst part was just the steep, heavy braking that then happened at one point, which is when we collided. That was the dangerous part.

“I felt grateful that I didn’t take us both out. For me, I need to be finishing both races and getting these points. It’s tough to do so with these circumstances. But yeah, I managed to keep the car in one piece.”

Edit, probably hear more about it next week as to more clear reasoning.

Editing the edit, added a bit at the start I missed.

 

[Blackie]

Your all misreading me.

I 100% agree Max caused the accident by a sharp jab of the brakes and should be penalised.

But IMO LH has to be penalised for his part also, saying he played no part in causing a dangerous situation is crazy. A car is slowing to one side of the track so you follow right behind him??? They both knew what they were doing IMO.

And no other information is very likely to change that view, did he provide an explanation for why he didn't pass him? I haven't seen one.

I’m clearly biased and as such I struggle to comprehend how Lewis had any blame in this incident?

Max was centre track and weaving whilst brake checking. Lewis has no message to inform him what Max was trying to do, so going back to the aforementioned driving behaviour of Max which meant that Lewis didn’t know which side to safely pass Max given that Max was weaving in front of him.

Yes Lewis could’ve braked, the telemetry doesn’t appear to have come through to show wether he tried to brake or not, but it’s clear that Max brake checked.

Now I don’t know about any of you, but on the normal road conditions it’s pretty damn hard to react quickly to a p***k brake checking you and that’s in slower cars with brake lights, those F1 cars give no indication when brake checking!

So I’m not really sure what Lewis was really expected to do in the situation.

 

[Blackie]

Karen doing his best hypocritical statements in the post race interview
“No Max didn’t brake suddenly……..there was a steady a gradual slowing down by Max. I haven’t seen all the data yet, but absolutely Max didn’t brake suddenly…..”

Yes of course he’s going to defend his driver, but he’s tripped himself up and made a Pratt of himself by saying “absolutely no braking” (paraphrasing) and then saying “I haven’t seen all the data”

Whereas Toto says he’s going to watch the race again tomorrow without the emotion before he makes up his mind on the incident and how fairly it was dealt with.

 

[svensktoppen]

Absolute total ****up from Massi, what a ****show. Sure, he easily had the hardest job on the planet those couple of hours, lol, but honestly that was appalling.

Total disaster of a track too, basically designed for huge accidents for "good TV".

I'm good with the end result and a final showdown next week.

I think the way RB and Max ran the race was way over the line, obvious "crash rather than give up position" tactics. Not just the once either but over and over and over again. David C is absolutely fine with all that though so hey.

No other driver would have got away with the brake testing. Nobody else.

I think the "penalty" means he will do the exact same things again next weekend. He has nine wins to eight for Lewis, so if neither of them finish then Max wins by default and on count back.

Other than that not a clue about anything else that happened

 

[Gibbo]

Having watched back again, like Brazil he took himself off the track defending, how are you supposed to overtake someone willing to do that.

The collision, a bit farcical on both parties and could have been avoided, Hamilton had a clear opportunity to blow past and max was indeed naughty for jabbing the brakes.

 

[carmad.]

i am going out today to buy a set of Bose headphones

they seam like they can take a bit off abuse lol

 

[Jrooney06]

Your all misreading me.

I 100% agree Max caused the accident by a sharp jab of the brakes and should be penalised.

But IMO LH has to be penalised for his part also, saying he played no part in causing a dangerous situation is crazy. A car is slowing to one side of the track so you follow right behind him??? They both knew what they were doing IMO.

And no other information is very likely to change that view, did he provide an explanation for why he didn't pass him? I haven't seen one.

Max gained an advantage by cutting the corner to stay in front. Hamilton would have had the whole lap to build a lead prior to the DRS down the pit straight Instead, they decided to give it back but half heartedly so because they were just going to repass using DRS. A few years ago vettel or alonso did they same trick with the DRS and the stewards penalised him. I don’t think max is particularly good in one to one racing. He either crashes into his opponent or pushes them off track. He sees it as hard racing I just see it as poor racecraft.

Absolute total ****up from Massi, what a ****show. Sure, he easily had the hardest job on the planet those couple of hours, lol, but honestly that was appalling.

Total disaster of a track too, basically designed for huge accidents for "good TV".

I'm good with the end result and a final showdown next week.

I think the way RB and Max ran the race was way over the line, obvious "crash rather than give up position" tactics. Not just the once either but over and over and over again. David C is absolutely fine with all that though so hey.

No other driver would have got away with the brake testing. Nobody else.

I think the "penalty" means he will do the exact same things again next weekend. He has nine wins to eight for Lewis, so if neither of them finish then Max wins by default and on count back.

Other than that not a clue about anything else that happened

That negotiation about grid position during the restart was odd. Since when did the rules not apply.

 

[CloudStrife]

That negotiation about grid position during the restart was odd. Since when did the rules not apply.

To be fair I think that was reasonable. It would have happened on track as well. If RBR had said no it would have been referred to the stewarts as normal.

 

[pablo]

I think people are forgetting Hamilton had at most a couple of seconds to figure out what was happening. Was it an obstruction, a crash, a mechanical failure? Maybe he did realise max was letting him past at the last second and it clicked about the drs zone who knows. Race cars don’t have brake lights.

One thing to remember though is Hamilton had a LOT more to lose from a collision than max did. A puncture even would have certainly ended the race and championship for him. You can’t really deny max braked heavily knowing 100% that Hamilton was behind him. Drs games aside that would explain the penalty. RB are lucky it was a penalty that didn’t affect this or the next race. No true fan wants to see the championship won that way. But maybe it will make Max cool his jets a bit and we get a good fair race.

 

[Blackie]

Now Marko is gurning that RBR are treated unfairly compared with Merc!

To me that shows the fundamental flaw that is running throughout the RBR team. When Marko and Horner both have this unshakable sense of unfair treatment and that’s clearly feeding into Verstappen’s already huge ego.

But maybe it will make Max cool his jets a bit and we get a good fair race.

Can’t see it happening. He’s so immature and I believe he’ll carry the anger through to next weekend!

 

[Mr.Mint]

I rarely weigh in here, but it's all just great to watch at the moment.

I had switched off there for about 3 years and then I decided to give this year a go and it's refreshing to watch in comparison to back then. People are actually having a chance against the Merc's and Lewis isn't having it all his own way (which brings me so much joy tbh)

I was one of the biggest Schumacher fans during his reign and even him winning all the time became mundane and I think these scraps all over the grid are what the sport needed to spark people's interest again. Roll on the finale, I think it will be wonderful to watch.

 

[Captain Starlet]

I rarely weigh in here, but it's all just great to watch at the moment.

I had switched off there for about 3 years and then I decided to give this year a go and it's refreshing to watch in comparison to back then. People are actually having a chance against the Merc's and Lewis isn't having it all his own way (which brings me so much joy tbh)

I was one of the biggest Schumacher fans during his reign and even him winning all the time became mundane and I think these scraps all over the grid are what the sport needed to spark people's interest again. Roll on the finale, I think it will be wonderful to watch.

Couldn't agree more, both are worthy champions. Hope the racing is close and fair but I can see a halo being put to the test .

Nobody wants to see one driver get pole and disappear.

 

[svensktoppen]

Max will "race" the exact same way next weekend. Nothing to lose for him, all to win. And if they crash, he wins. It's as much about intimidation as anything else.

He also knows the current rights holders like it and let him get away with it. It's good TV, and RB (as in the parent drinks company) will have a huge advertising deal with them anyway regardless of F1.

It's nothing to do with immaturity. Max and RB know exactly what they're doing.

Title decider next weekend, which is fair allround I think.

 

[cauld1]

What I don't get is, if he was trying to let Hamilton passed and then get into DRS zone to retake the position again would he not get penalised for that too?

Not that himself or RB seem too keen on, you know, rules.

It has been a good season all the same!

 

[pablo]

seemed like a shrewd strategy to me, minimise the impact of giving up a place.

its all moot anyway really there was no way Max was winning that race even without the shenanigans

 

[cauld1]

It is shrewd, but, you cannot immediately retake a position after giving it back.

As an aside, I see the past few pages where people saying about having an opinion and expressing it etc, and that's 100% correct. However, when some of the utterly blinkered nonsense that gets posted is posted, don't be surprised when people respond to it

 

[PaulYDP]

But letting someone past in a strategic way is not an offence thats playing the rules. If a driver offers you a place by slowing down you cant not take it then ask again for it.

Edited as I see you've finally admited Max was at fault!

Hamilton didn't know the place was getting handed back and given the past antics of Max he had every right to be cautious and remain behind to get the DRS if he wanted to. The accident was 100% caused by Max braking, had he not hit the brakes it didn't happen end of story. There are no rules to say you must pass the car in front of you (especially when you don't know they've been instructed to hand the place back) however there are rules to stop drivers deliberately causing a collision! Surely Max could see Lewis was literally a few meters behind the rear of his car. Could his brain not compute what would happen when he hit the brakes!? I think Max is cracking under the pressure.

I can see Max doing a do or die in the next race early on to ensure he wins the championship.

 

[Jbridges522]

In giving a place back having taken it in an unfair manner it is the responsibility of the lead car to ensure that this happens in a safe manner, that's the law. So are you telling me that braking with a force of 69bar causing a 2.4g deacceleration when you can clearly see the other car is directly behind you is safe!?? Surely Max understands what's going to happen if he hits the brakes with another car directly behind?

You also have to remember that Hamilton didn't know the place was getting handed back and given the past antics of Max he had every right to be cautious and remain behind to get the DRS if he wanted to. Maybe you've access to telemetery, radio messages and all sorts that the stewards didn't though so you know best? You'd certainly think it by reading your messages

Clearly haven't read all the messages then.......

It is shrewd, but, you cannot immediately retake a position after giving it back.

You can as long as the car is fully passed you and its pretty common practise down the years.

The collision, a bit farcical on both parties and could have been avoided, Hamilton had a clear opportunity to blow past and max was indeed naughty for jabbing the brakes.

Exactly, neither party was innocent.