ANPR Cameras in Northern Ireland debate
- Thread starter Orwell
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stevieturbo
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Does look pretty good though. But no doubt having it installed will be punishable by firing squad
Karlos Da Jackle
RMS Regular
Going to revive this puppy.
Got some questions. These ANPR cameras that we have been discussing. What do they cover??
ANPR what i thhought it was, was teh onboard system in Police cars, it kind of covers everything, tax, insurance, mot, and is even used as teh recording for motoring offences and for speeding.
This whole topic has been about Fixed ANPR cameras, ok, I gather they do, tax insurance, mot, car movements, tracking it. But do they do speeding, at that point? Or even average speed checking?
Got some questions. These ANPR cameras that we have been discussing. What do they cover??
ANPR what i thhought it was, was teh onboard system in Police cars, it kind of covers everything, tax, insurance, mot, and is even used as teh recording for motoring offences and for speeding.
This whole topic has been about Fixed ANPR cameras, ok, I gather they do, tax insurance, mot, car movements, tracking it. But do they do speeding, at that point? Or even average speed checking?
pablo
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nothing speed related Karlos, just logging really.
On the flipside, the c**t that ran that wee lad over and left him to die may have been caught on ANPR if there was one nearby. One good use of it anyway if the software is able to filter out everyone who passed in a certain timeframe and then filter out vehicle type and colour etc. Prob no cameras nearby tho.
ANPR btw is just to do with automated number plate recognition in software, not really anything to do with the physical camera or its location.
On the flipside, the c**t that ran that wee lad over and left him to die may have been caught on ANPR if there was one nearby. One good use of it anyway if the software is able to filter out everyone who passed in a certain timeframe and then filter out vehicle type and colour etc. Prob no cameras nearby tho.
ANPR btw is just to do with automated number plate recognition in software, not really anything to do with the physical camera or its location.
stevieturbo
RMS Regular
They record the movements of every single innocent person for approx 2 years. Occasionally there may be some criminals in there too. Now what they do with that information afterwards is the big concern, or what they use the cameras for in the future is a big concern.
The bloody things are everywhere. Next it'll be pay per mile, or some other random fine generator.
http://maps.google.co.uk/maps/ms?ms...&ll=54.692884,-5.784302&spn=1.247681,2.796021
Just saw something that reminded me of this thread
A silver mondeo ( CHZ ****) parked up at the side of Nutts corner rd at Ldls, with the driver standing in the middle of the lane taking pictures of the ANPRs cameras just before the roundabout.
I wonder did i spot Orwell
A silver mondeo ( CHZ ****) parked up at the side of Nutts corner rd at Ldls, with the driver standing in the middle of the lane taking pictures of the ANPRs cameras just before the roundabout.
I wonder did i spot Orwell
stevieturbo
RMS Regular
I wonder how much the poles would yield in scrap value. Might be worth cutting them down and weighing them in ! lol
DEEJAY.B
RMS Regular
Is this thread still open ! ?. .
stevieturbo
RMS Regular
Soon the government will be putting all sorts of pills in the water.
Rover Repair
RMS Regular
They already do man.....
Karlos Da Jackle
RMS Regular
As it happens, the last few times I've been home, I've noticed them everywhere.
Now not that i was doing anything wrong, but everytime i did pass one, I felt like a criminal,lol. Horrible looking things as well.
Now not that i was doing anything wrong, but everytime i did pass one, I felt like a criminal,lol. Horrible looking things as well.
Cro
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I got my sh*t rolled a couple of weeks back when 3 guys bounced out of a car. They jumped back in and I got the reg, make, model and they drove past at least 2 sets of fixed anpr cameras and the police can't prove the car left the house that day.... hardly useful then
stevieturbo
RMS Regular
The only criminals they will be used against.....are law abiding motorists.
There's little doubt they passed more than two. There are thousands of them
http://maps.google.co.uk/maps/ms?ie...d=217547757041314517647.0004a03ad9fbe9f40a116
stevieturbo
RMS Regular
I think you are right,. We will never know when they will be of use. And we will never be able to avail of their information to help normal civilians/victims of crime.
As Cro has already shown.
stevieturbo
RMS Regular
As Ive said. In theory yes if they are used properly, then they would be fantastic. But lets face it, the police operate them.
Karlos Da Jackle
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Well for poor Cro, they weren't very helpful,lol, and he wa strying to have them used.
DaddyCC
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Is this the start of Stevies paranoia?!
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-14903028
Not a bad idea in some respects if it stays as this, as it makes if more fair, but will it continue into the monster we expect?!
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-14903028
Not a bad idea in some respects if it stays as this, as it makes if more fair, but will it continue into the monster we expect?!
stevieturbo
RMS Regular
Clealry whoever wrote the report of 5 year study is clueless. They say £4 out of every £10 earned goes to the government in tax ?
Where is this low tax utopia ? Sure as hell isnt anywhere I know.
They take approximately 23% of our wages. Then they take 20% of every damn thing we spend money on. Then the whopping 80+% taxation on fuel. 5% Insurance tax ? Plus god knows what other taxes we dont know about.
I'd throw a wild figure out there and say the government take around 50-60% of every pound we earn.
And the simplicity of purely taxing road fuel for road use and abolishing all other extortionate and unfair taxes on motorists will never happen. And the article above says why. Because as people move to more efficient cars, or electric etc....the goverment start to lose revenue, so they need to get this back.
So they may try and push people towards what are allegedly cleaner/cheaper vehicles. But this is the start...the more people do go that route, then the government will seek ways to tax them.
So may as well buy a V8 and enjoy it while you can.
A communist regime might not be that far away.
Where is this low tax utopia ? Sure as hell isnt anywhere I know.
They take approximately 23% of our wages. Then they take 20% of every damn thing we spend money on. Then the whopping 80+% taxation on fuel. 5% Insurance tax ? Plus god knows what other taxes we dont know about.
I'd throw a wild figure out there and say the government take around 50-60% of every pound we earn.
And the simplicity of purely taxing road fuel for road use and abolishing all other extortionate and unfair taxes on motorists will never happen. And the article above says why. Because as people move to more efficient cars, or electric etc....the goverment start to lose revenue, so they need to get this back.
So they may try and push people towards what are allegedly cleaner/cheaper vehicles. But this is the start...the more people do go that route, then the government will seek ways to tax them.
So may as well buy a V8 and enjoy it while you can.
A communist regime might not be that far away.
- Thread Starter
- #549
I was not here to answer questions. I was not here to convert people. I was not here to convince people.
I was here to inform, thats all. People are well able and free to make their own minds up, far be it from me to manipulate them.
And when i was threatened with thread closure i left.
And by the way, i answered as many of your questions as you answered of mine.
http://maps.google.co.uk/maps/ms?ie...4.76267,-6.80603&spn=1.361246,4.22699&t=h&z=9
Hey all,
I've been reading this long thread now. And I must say I'm quite surprised by some remarks of some contributors:
1. Nothing to hide, nothing to fear- well if you've done nothing wrong, why would you need to be watched? Shouldn't being trusted be the norm rather then being watched? What's wrong with this society?
2. Uninsured vehicles, untaxed vehicles: How comes this is such a big topic in NI and the UK? Go abroad: France, Belgium, Holland, Germany etc. they all hardly use ANPR cams to find uninsured/untaxed vehicles. They have other ways of making sure the system works. Why would ANPR be needed here... and all that it comes with (mostly the cost of tax payer's money!)?
Example: In Germany you need to set up a direct debit for car tax. If there's no money in the account, they come to your registered address- and they would take you to court instead of crush your vehicle. MOT is checked only by a sticker on the plate. No ANPR needed but it works.
3. Couldn't care less as I'm all legal: Stasi would have loved ANPR! The Berlin Wall would still be there had they've had it.
And what is legal and what is not can change overnight. Once a govt got a tool to use against you, it will be difficult to fight a change in law- because this might be declared illegal. In 1932 it was legal to be a jew in Munich. In 1942 ANPR could have cought the jew driving in his car which he wasn't allowed to own anymore.
4. Finally it's the athmosphere ANPR can create. There was a reason why people in Birmingham wanted to have them removed: Because they weren't consulted and they felt they were unjustly put under suspicion. ANPR creates an athmosphere of suspicion. A society cannot work on this basis. Surveillance needs to be restricted to occasions with a specific suspicion otherwise trust must prevail.
5. Crime fighting: ANPR is illegal in Germany because it puts everybody under a general suspicion. Hence it cannot be used without a targeted suspicion (which means officers needs to check specific plates individually).
Question: Is NI/UK so much safer then other countries that do not use ANPR? Lots of terorists in France and Belgium?
Would be interesting to hear the view of those who came up with the "can't care less" and "nothing to hide" arguments here...
Steve
I've been reading this long thread now. And I must say I'm quite surprised by some remarks of some contributors:
1. Nothing to hide, nothing to fear- well if you've done nothing wrong, why would you need to be watched? Shouldn't being trusted be the norm rather then being watched? What's wrong with this society?
2. Uninsured vehicles, untaxed vehicles: How comes this is such a big topic in NI and the UK? Go abroad: France, Belgium, Holland, Germany etc. they all hardly use ANPR cams to find uninsured/untaxed vehicles. They have other ways of making sure the system works. Why would ANPR be needed here... and all that it comes with (mostly the cost of tax payer's money!)?
Example: In Germany you need to set up a direct debit for car tax. If there's no money in the account, they come to your registered address- and they would take you to court instead of crush your vehicle. MOT is checked only by a sticker on the plate. No ANPR needed but it works.
3. Couldn't care less as I'm all legal: Stasi would have loved ANPR! The Berlin Wall would still be there had they've had it.
And what is legal and what is not can change overnight. Once a govt got a tool to use against you, it will be difficult to fight a change in law- because this might be declared illegal. In 1932 it was legal to be a jew in Munich. In 1942 ANPR could have cought the jew driving in his car which he wasn't allowed to own anymore.
4. Finally it's the athmosphere ANPR can create. There was a reason why people in Birmingham wanted to have them removed: Because they weren't consulted and they felt they were unjustly put under suspicion. ANPR creates an athmosphere of suspicion. A society cannot work on this basis. Surveillance needs to be restricted to occasions with a specific suspicion otherwise trust must prevail.
5. Crime fighting: ANPR is illegal in Germany because it puts everybody under a general suspicion. Hence it cannot be used without a targeted suspicion (which means officers needs to check specific plates individually).
Question: Is NI/UK so much safer then other countries that do not use ANPR? Lots of terorists in France and Belgium?
Would be interesting to hear the view of those who came up with the "can't care less" and "nothing to hide" arguments here...
Steve
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